HOW TO DEFEAT THE ISLAMOFASCIST JIHADISTS IN GAZA?

by Felix Quigley

December 26, 2008

A discussion has just appeared on Israpundit concerning Gaza. For months the Islamofascist Hamas which seeks to destroy Israel (Fatah does too) has been during a truce!!! showering the Israeli land with rockets.

Hamas is financed from both the EU, the US and from Iran. During these past months and few years Hamas has built its firepower to a huge extent so that very few parts of tiny Israel are free from being hit by their rockets. But the question of what to do is essential a question of revolutionary socialist tactics and to a certain extent is psychological. Only with the building of a Trotskyist party in Israel can correct tactics be developed.

It is in that light that we reproduce part of the discussion on Israpundit:

[begin discussion on Israpundit here]

What to do with Gaza

By Ted Belman

In the posts just below this one, both Eiland and Beilin recommend full disengagement from Gaza which means opening it up to the sea and to Egypt. Beilin is from the extreme left (Oslo Accords and the Geneva Initiative) and Eiland is only somewhat to the left. But that is no reason to reject this idea out of hand.

(I interrupt here. This is Belman up to his usual mischief concerning his definition of the Left. In answer to Belman´s lies on this score we assert most forcefully that Belinin is NOT from the “Left” or worse “extreme Left”…FQ)

As for the rocket attacks, Beilin writes,

    Should Qassams and Grad rockets be fired from the Gaza Strip despite the above, we will always reserve the military option, and the IDF would always be able to reoccupy this crowded and problematic place, even if this comes with a heavy price.

and Eiland simply says

    Arms are reaching Gaza anyway, and opening the crossing would once and for absolve Israel of accusations of “occupation.”

Both believe that our blockade of Gaza doesn’t stop the flow of arms and comes at a diplomatic cost.

To my mind, any diplomatic benefit which may accrue to Israel due to the lifting of control would not be worth the military risk in allowing Iran to have full sway in Gaza.

That is not to say Israel should invade Gaza immediately. But Israel must stop the rocket attacks.

Israel should

    1) return to assassinating the Hamas leadership with a vengeance.
    2) announce that she will devastate with artillery any location from which a rocket is fired.
    3) destroy with artillery any arms factory of cache
    4) occupy the southern strip for a couple of miles and destroy all the tunnels.
    5) occupy the northern 5 miles of so to distance the rocket launching from Sderot and other communities.

As for the fear of international condemnation and prosecution for war crimes due to the artillery fire, Israel should pay no heed. Better to have its leadership accused of war crimes than to order an invasion that would result in the death of dozens of soldiers.

Under no conditions should Israel destroy Hamas only to turn Gaza over to Fatah.

(This is the centre of Belman´s argument and in this he is precisely correct. It is on this that Israpundit should concentrate…FQ)

Beilin also comments on how swimmingly things are going in Judea and Samaria. What matters to me is not how we are getting along but how we can retain control over Judea and Samaria. Israel must keep all of Area “B” and “C” as delineated by Oslo. The object of our policies should be to keep this land rather than to get along.

(When Belman starts talking about B and C watch out. This is a recipe for Belman betrayal. Forget B and C, forget Oslo, the Israeli people now need to take control in revolutionary struggle of at least all of Judea and Samaria, Gaza, Golan, present day Israel and administer this as a unit…FQ)

Posted by Ted Belman @ 6:54 am |

 

13 Comments »

  1.  

    It remains a mystery to me as to why Israel has refused to defend its citizens against Hamas terrorists.

    If Israel merely met them with equal force, missile for missile, the Pals would be running out the back door to Egypt. And that is what should be happening – the Arab states need to take responsibility for their own shameful lack of concern over the terrorism that they have created and promoted.

    It is time that the seeds of violence the Arab states have sown come home to impact Egypt, Syria, Jordan and all other neighbors who sit smugly by while Israel is torn apart by bombs and the weight of international condemnation (Israel really deserves condemnation for doing nothing to defend themselves against the vicious terrorists not for the reasons that the world falsely accuses them).

    The world will condemn Israel regardless of what they do or not do. The only important problem at this time is to stop terrorism and missile attacks. Ted has a good list that would make for an excellent strategy. Israel must listen and stop encouraging terrorism by ignoring it and then trying to get brownie points for sacrificing its people to terrorism.

    Comment by Gary — December 24, 2008 @ 8:31 am


  2.  

    Israel has a hostile entity on its doorstep which will not surrender or be voted out of power. As has been stated many times, invading Gaza is easy, getting out is not. IDF troops would be subject to the dangers of door-to-door combat as they faced in Jenin and would have to re-occupy the strip following the operation.

    Far better to elect the Indian Kashmir approach. India has been shelling militant positions in Kashmir for 20 years. Thousands have died and yet the world largely ignores the conflict because they are inured to it. Hamas wants a war of attrition; Israel should give it to them. Hand off all power and aid responsibilities to Egypt and let the shelling begin.

    20 years from today, we shall see what remains of Palestinian “society”.

    Comment by Charles Martel — December 24, 2008 @ 12:29 pm


  3.  

    Charles, you are far off base in your comments. Return shelling is the same old tit for tat that has gone on for years. A democratic nation can not survive under those conditions. Look around at all of the nations in this world who have their security because they were willing to fight for it. War is war and there will be friendly casualties of Israelis; however, attrition would doom Israel into her demise in a number of years. I say that Israel should raise her banner and clobber Hamas into death or surrender, occupy Gaza, controling her security in the south and west.

    I, also, believe that Israel should build defense plants in the Negev in order to create weapons that Israel has to beg for. Defense factories could also provide thousands of jobs and to bolster her economy.

    The International community condemns Israel now, so let’s give them a bonified reason.

    Comment by Ed D — December 24, 2008 @ 12:49 pm


  4.  

    Ed, I defer to your military expertise but really, can you tell me when (outside of a short war), Israel has ever consistently and overwhelmingly blanketed enemy territory with projectiles? Life would be a much greater hell for the Arabs.

    Besides, retaking Gaza will upset yamit and Ted’s strategy of maintaining Hamas in power indefinitely so as to frustrate international calls for a Palestinian state.

    Comment by Charles Martel — December 24, 2008 @ 1:18 pm


  5.  

    Most Israelis have developed an aversion to Gaza even before the beginning of the state but that strip if left to it’s inhabitants mostly from Jaffa and center of Israel have an inborn hatred of Israel far stronger than most other Arabs I lived among them for over 10 years, and did most of my active and reserve duty in the Southern command including Gaza Strip. The Gaza Strip is historical Israel and the Arabs are occupying our Land so din Yehuda and Shomron din Gaza. Israel must work to depopulate the strip of Arabs, and take it back and resettle it with Jews. Since over 80% of population are neither native Gazans nor their decedents but so called refugees mostly from Tel Aviv area and center of Israel villages any place they are resettled or driven to is no difference as for most of them in alien Gaza that few of them view as a permanent home. Hamas and Islamic Jihad have given us enough casus belli to wipe the strip clean of Arabs,. The idea being that it should be quick min loss of life and permanent.

    Ed is correct Charles we don’t want tit for tat situation where they control the tempo, timing and methods of the conflict. At the very least Israel must punish Hamas so severely that they begin to understand that to continue would mean their individual and collective eradication.

    Comment by yamit82 — December 24, 2008 @ 1:18 pm


  6.  

    For every firing of rockets out of Gaza, Israel needs to annex a one or two mile strip of northern Gaza, flushing whatever Gaza residents are there down south. This annexation has to be permanent, never open to negotiations. If the palestinians can’t control themselves, then they will eventually be flushed into Sinai.

    Until Israel learns that it must TAKE land for every attack that is committed against it (such as in the last Lebanon War) the attacks will not stop. The arabs must pay a price for attacking Israel, which is currently not the case – and with the Lebanon War, the arabs even got a piece of land put back into play (Shebaa Farms), thanks to the morons at Kadima.

    Comment by progressoverpeace — December 24, 2008 @ 1:41 pm


  7.  

    to #6: “flush” is the perfect word.

    Comment by bugsy — December 24, 2008 @ 8:32 pm


  8.  

    Regarding an invasion of Gaza, Israel cannot afford another victory over the Arabs. It is too embarrassing to these hypersensitive Muslims (though loss of life is irrelevant) and it would take decades to assuage there hurt feelings and get them back to talking peace. Can you imagine what would happen if Israel succeeded in destroying Iran’s nuclear and arms production facilities! The Iranians would remember forever and a Jew would not be able to walk within ten feet of a Persian without wondering if he was going to survive the encounter for just that long – forever. That is why no attack has occurred until now. The Persians practice a religion of mourning and revenge. Until they give up their “beliefs,” no one is safe – not Jew, Christian, Sunni Muslim, or even a doubting Persian. Their motto is “Death to everyone, including me.”

    Comment by jerry — December 24, 2008 @ 9:57 pm


  9.  

    violence from gaza is encouraged by the perception that there will be another state west of the jordan river. it will never succeed. ending the delusion is the first step to stabilizing the entire area west of the jordan river.

    the following was originally distributed on july 12, 2006!

    The verdict is in. The experiment in Gaza has proven that Arab leadership has no interest in creating a peaceful society living alongside Israel in harmony and tolerance. Therefore, we hereby declare that the occupation and administration of the West Bank has been terminated.
    The entire West Bank without exception is declared to be an integral part of the State of Israel.
    The Palestinian Authority is hereby disbanded. All quasi-governmental agencies, militia groups and organizations and entities hostile to the Jewish State of Israel are ordered to be disbanded. All weapons are to be deposited with local police and military authorities.
    Residents of the West Bank who accept the authority of Israel will be candidates for permanent residency and/or citizenship. Others will be removed to the Gaza Strip with appropriate financial consideration.
    The Jewish State of Israel will be governed by local authorities elected in district elections over the next two years. The civil and religious rights of all peoples will be respected.
    Arabs who have escaped from the West Bank into pre-1967 Israel will be welcome to return to their homes on the West Bank.
    An era of prosperity, social reform and political stability will come after the removal of the current violent, corrupt leadership.
    It is time for sane unilateral actions. Oslo, Camp David, Roadmap, Two-state solutions have failed. A permanent solution is required.
    Further information and details can be found at http://www.onejewishstate.com

    Michael Wise

    Comment by mikewise — December 25, 2008 @ 7:22 am


  10.  

    mikewise: great plan except it should be expanded to the original borders of the mandate and Balfour Declaration, why limit Israels borders only to the Jordan River? The little King will eventually be overthrown By Hamas or other Islamic radicals and then we will have an enemy with modern weapons and all the prerogatives of an enemy state directly on our eastern border probably with the help and support of the whole world. Without Israel the Little King would not last a year in Power. Democracy has no place in the middle east and I doubt seriously anyplace else as it allows multiculturalism, pluralism, nihilism and rule by the lowest common denominators of values national narratives and nationalism itself to be clouded and influenced by a majority of the self interested to subvert the collective and even the national interest. If By democracy you mean one man one vote, equality of all citizens under one common Law, then this in the end would eventually allow a large minority to dominate the Israeli and Jewish concepts of national particularism. All That supposes that the Arab minority would continue to be so. I don’t know of any sane Israeli who today believes that the Arab who have today Israli citizenship would ever cease to be recidivists and cease becoming what the Torah calls a thorn in our side if not an actual 5th column.

    major religious limitation is the concept of ger toshav. The Torah presumes a strong, politically incorrect, ethnically conscious Israeli state and so allows a number of foreigners to reside there as submissive resident aliens who respect the state’s Jewish character. Rabbis uncritically grafted that concept onto modern Israel. Kahane accepts that some Arabs can live in Israel with restricted civil rights. That won’t work. They will cry injustice, protest against apartheid, bring their extended families to Israel in family reunion schemes, and breed on Israeli welfare. No Arabs should be left in Israel, with the possible exception of those married to renegade Jews.

    Other than allowing any Arabs to remain in any part of the Land of Israel and Republican Democracy as the system of governance I agree with everything else.

    Comment by yamit82 — December 25, 2008 @ 11:10 am


  11.  

    Jerry:

    Regarding an invasion of Gaza, Israel cannot afford another victory over the Arabs. It is too embarrassing to these hypersensitive Muslims (though loss of life is irrelevant) and it would take decades to assuage there hurt feelings and get them back to talking peace. Can you imagine what would happen if Israel succeeded in destroying Iran’s nuclear and arms production facilities! The Iranians would remember forever and a Jew would not be able to walk within ten feet of a Persian without wondering if he was going to survive the encounter for just that long – forever. That is why no attack has occurred until now. The Persians practice a religion of mourning and revenge. Until they give up their “beliefs,” no one is safe – not Jew, Christian, Sunni Muslim, or even a doubting Persian. Their motto is “Death to everyone, including me.”

    I think you are confused the current Jewish Holiday is Chanukah and not Purim; Unless you are really serious and then my ans to you would be serious and to the point and you would not like to read what I could write about you then.

    Comment by yamit82 — December 25, 2008 @ 11:15 am


  12.  

    To Jerry in #8. I am assuming that you are serious in your statement. If that is the case I am wondering if you were born an idiot or worked hard to become one?

    Comment by Ed D — December 25, 2008 @ 1:07 pm


  13.  

    Yamit:

    Ed is correct Charles we don’t want tit for tat situation where they control the tempo, timing and methods of the conflict. At the very least Israel must punish Hamas so severely that they begin to understand that to continue would mean their individual and collective eradication 

    You are kidding yourself if you believe Israel is completely sovereign in it ability to attack Gaza. It is still very much a puppet of America and E.U. Otherwise why is there a quartet guiding the Israeli-Pals negotiations?. Why is Israel still being held responsible for Gaza as is indicated by the numerous times the borders were unsealed? what about the recent tranfer of 100 mil shekels by Israel to Hamas after a request (order) by World bank.None of this can be explained except by frankly stating the fact that Israel is still very much subject to very powerful outside forces.We also know that with the new American presidency, Israel will have to contend with an increase in outside pressure.

    Comment by palworthy — December 25, 2008 @ 10:59 pm

  14. http://www.israpundit.com/2008/?p=6700#more-6700

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